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View Room Comments for Friday, Dec. 28 2012

Friday, December 28, 2012   by: The Soap BoxWelcome to the SooToday.com View Room. This editorial feature is for you to post comments. To comment on a specific news story please post your comment directly under the news story.
Comments
39
Note: Comments that appear on the site are not the opinion of SooToday.com. If you see an abusive post, please click the link beside the post to report it.
skipper dave 12/28/2012 5:00:44 AM Report

Good morning sweet Soo!
Steely I am living proof that you do not die if solid food does not pass your lips as long as you maintain fluid levels and electrolytes. I was 21 days plus another ten in short order. Lost thirty pounds. So as much as you would like to brand the Chief a fraud I think she's genuine. The tragedy is the Prime minister probably has the same view of our First Nation Chief as you do. An ignorant parasitic aboriginal looking for a bigger hand out.
Something totally different here red neck Steely. No. 1-she is a woman and 2- her movement has drawn out the support of the young first nation. Run Steely, run. They want things like the total elimination and relocation of isolated impoverished reserves (I recommend southern Ontario golf courses.) They want control over their own resources (much like us) not just a step in the negotiation process and that after the deal been closed. I do agree they are protesting in the wrong spot. Have picket lines set up around the legislature to slow down the members of parliament. Camp out in government buildings and police stations. Build a big snow fort around harpers house. throw snow balls on the hour at the legislature. Occupy for an hour a local high school each and every day. Shake hands with a teacher.
nanag 12/28/2012 7:41:08 AM Report

Good morning Everyone

Hope your Friday goes well.

Tugboatnick..

interesting video.. makes you wonder huh?
skipper dave 12/28/2012 7:48:08 AM Report

Alright - today I'm going to make a decision to keep my mug out of discussions that tend to wander off the path into the realm of bigotry and racism.
Wicket good luck today and if anyone else is free hey join me at the new barn (SAH) maybe we can stick a tube into you just for the hell of it.
Just Curious 12/28/2012 8:27:47 AM Report

tugboatnick, that video gives one something to think about alright.
scottstewy123 12/28/2012 8:50:48 AM Report

That is a revealing video
Wicket 12/28/2012 9:16:40 AM Report

TODAY is the day! Good morning all, looking forward to seeing many of you later and having good, friendly and interesting conversation. Food will also be good.
Skipper Dave, we will think of you and mention your name, probably a lot, as probably unbeknown to you, you are held in high esteem for being you.
theprotector 12/28/2012 9:34:22 AM Report

SO why doesnt the first nations go on a major education program? Lets start using the media to expose the real truth about the treatment of the first nations in Canada? GO with commercialsm talk shows etc...international money from amenesty international or many of the orgs tied to the UN since the UN has condemned Canada on its treatment of first nations as the worst in the industrial world. It is not about hand outs...its about building capacity, its about the non-aboridgnal population leaving the stereotypes on the roadside. Its about fair treatment. I disagree with the blockade for those reasons lets educate the racists and the hateful. If they are too ignorant to understand then THEY can leave this great country!
Brianne 12/28/2012 9:36:37 AM Report

Another massive Chinese-owned resource project is before Prime Minister Stephen Harper’s cabinet.

Some time in the new year, four federal ministers are to decide how to conduct an environmental review for the Izok Corridor proposal. It could bring many billions of dollars into the Arctic but would also see development of open-pit mines, roads, ports and other facilities in the centre of calving grounds for the fragile Bathurst caribou herd.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/industry-news/energy-and-resources/harpers-cabinet-mulls-massive-chinese-resource-project-in-arctic/article6752413/
right wing 12/28/2012 10:00:06 AM Report

tugboatnick

How dare you post a revealing video full of facts and truth.
This is "The View Room", the view according to a handful of lefty Harper Haters.
Are you trying to shatter their world?
Prepare to be set afire.
...good work.
Keep it up.
highway1 12/28/2012 10:05:22 AM Report

theprotector, you are right, education is the answer.
That's part of the INM objective. The media didn't report this, but there were far more supportive gestures than middle fingers at the event yesterday. Many truckers and everyday motorists were blowing their horns in support, and people were smiling and waving, when receiving information flyers.
Of course there were also those who, lets say, disagreed.
Educating the types of people who consistently post hateful remarks just doesn't work. Many have tried, but the haters minds are made up. They have that right.
One thing I'd like to mention; the upside down Canadian flag.
An upside down flag is a universally recognized symbol of distress. It is an S.O.S. It is not meant to show disrespect to Canada, but to bring attention to the fact that the country is in trouble, and it is declaring to all who see it that the country needs help.
the_mage 12/28/2012 10:13:41 AM Report

well spoken highwayman. Everybody has been moaning about the flag. no one has come forward with the signifigance. this country is in dire need and in distress.
highway1 12/28/2012 10:38:02 AM Report

rw, not everyone who opposes the Harper government is a "lefty".
However, when it comes to issues of constitutional and inherent rights, hundreds of years of lies, non consultation and dis respect, some of us have no choice but to come into league with the "leftys" and forcefully oppose the Harper government.
If you and I were to sit down and chat over a coffee, you would see that we agree on 99% of the opinions you share on this forum.
7058262 12/28/2012 11:29:34 AM Report

They are also protesting that the Harper Government is not consulting enough or doing enough — which is puzzling to most Canadians, particularly Conservatives, because they know the Harper Government has focused on this community more than most previous governments.
For example, on my list of accomplishments for the period 2006-2011, the Harper government:
Made a formal parliamentary apology (#5); Made Arctic Sovereignty a priority (#6); Brought in gender equality for Native women (#22); Signed the Indian Residential Agreement and set up a Reconciliation Commission (#33); Settled 800+ land claims agreements, more than any previous federal government (#39); Announced a Northern Regional Development Economic Agency (#43); and Completed the Nunavik Inuit Land Claim Agreement (#44).
Then, there is what the Harper Government allocates to Native issues, over and above the billions they usually spend. Check out this Budget 2012 page, for example. Some $707.7 million is invested in stimulus over three years for Northern communities. Another $691.8 million for First Nations Education, water infrastructure and for an urban Aboriginal strategy.
So, what is the real issue behind “Idle No More?” Is the problem Bill C-45, the Omnibus budget Bill that the Natives claim will adversely affect the way reserve lands are leased? Or, is the protesting against that Bill simply a distraction from Bill C-27, An Act to enhance the financial accountability and transparency of First Nations.
Regarding C-45, Blake Richards, the MP for Wild Rose, says:”What it’s doing is, like the rest of our budget, it’s focusing on being able to create jobs and growth and prosperity for all Canadians and that includes our First Nations — these changes don’t alter treaty rights or any land claims processes at all. [Richards also said] It’s unfortunate they [Native leaders] didn’t take the opportunity to contact their member of parliament and let me know of their concerns.”
However, let’s take a closer look at C-27 which is, effectively, at the core of this post about responsibilities versus entitlements. At present, every Canadian government sends billions to reserves for every conceivable need.
Yet, there are hundreds, if not thousands, of Aboriginal children, youth and adults currently living in squalor and third world conditions. Why? We don’t actually know because there doesn’t seem to be any systematic accounting of what the money is spent on, as there is with municipal governments.
Why might that lack of accountability be a problem? Well, for one thing, as this taxpayer.com site shows, there are questions that need to be answered. While I don’t want to tarnish all Aboriginal leaders with the same brush, taxpayer.com reports that in the 2008-09 year:
“50 reserve politicians were paid more than Prime Minister Harper; 160 reserve politicians were paid more than their respective premiers; over 600 received an income that is equivalent to over $100,000 off reserve; and one Atlantic Canada reserve politician was paid $978,468 tax-free (which is equal to about $1.8 million off reserve).”
So, while “Idle No More” talk about Bill C-45, the real source of Native anger – which I believe is accountability — goes under-reported.
The thing is, this distrust of the Canadian government and the aversion to change and accountability is not knew. Back as far as 1969, none other than former PM and then Aboriginal Affairs Minister Jean Chretien saw what was happening to Native peoples and released a White Paper which, surprisingly proposed to:
“Eliminate Indian status;Dissolve the Department of Indian Affairs within five years; Abolish the Indian Act; Convert reserve land to private property that can be sold by the band or its members; Transfer responsibility for Indian affairs from the federal government to the province and integrate these services into those provided to other Canadian citizens; Provide funding for economic development; and Appoint a commissioner to address outstanding land claims and gradually terminate existing treaties.”
The reaction then, unfortunately, was as predictable as now. Aboriginal leaders across Canada were shocked and appalled that the ideas in the paper were not part of the consultation process preceding it and considered it just part of the fabric of oppression created by non-aboriginals.
So here we are again. Just as in the past, some of Canada’s journalists don’t seem to see that the issue is, actually, accountability and resistance to change. For example, the Toronto Star’s Jeff Dennis and Michael Harris both write about Attawapiskat Chief Theresa Spence and her hunger strike as though she has reason to draw attention to her band’s plight.
In fact, Harris goes so far as to suggest that the Harper government is responsible for hollow talk and half lies, saying: ”If you want to know why Attawapiskat Chief Theresa Spence is on a hunger strike, it is because official apologies from on high do not feed families, build houses, install water systems or educate kids. It is because some of the poorest bands in the country have concluded that Stephen Harper has to be put on the spot.”
Well, Mr Harris, you’re right, apologies don’t do any of those things. But the millions upon millions of dollars provided by the federal government and the millions provided by the De Beers diamond mine should.
The crux of the matter is that all public tax payer money has strings attached, always has and always will. Be it Bill C-45 or C-27, government officials and Cabinets make decisions that not everyone agrees with. That is the essence of democracy. Meaning, if Aboriginals don’t like something, they should not only consult with their own Chiefs, but their MPs as well.
So, while it may not be politically correct to say it, the “Idle No More” campaign needs to be about both First Nations entitlements and their corresponding responsibili
phesoj 12/28/2012 11:30:05 AM Report

Nice video tugboatnick. Bet that surprised a few people. Certainly surprised me.
Notice how there is no "Comments" to respond to the Idle No More Protest at Garden River. Things that make you go Hmmm !!!
Don't suppose "Idle no more" means get up of our backsides eh !
Zing 12/28/2012 11:30:48 AM Report

According to that video, there is enough money given to the reserves, but it is not going to members of the reserves, rather just the chiefs and their staff.

Yeah, our country is in trouble, but from where is the trouble originating?

I had to go to Garden River yesterday, Hwy 17B was totally blocked. I was told to take Hwy 17 and take the first road to the right to get there. That road I took was not even ploughed, it was just like a wide snowmobile trail.

Thank heavens I had snow tires on.
Wicket 12/28/2012 11:32:26 AM Report

Everything is ready!
Brianne 12/28/2012 11:46:53 AM Report

Have a great afternoon Wicket and company !

Off to work for me :(
Jimssm 12/28/2012 12:10:20 PM Report

Most on here don't seem to realize Native issues are a just a very small part of bill C45.

It's time for some of you to wake up and declare (as Stephen Harper did) that bill C45 is undemocratic.
right wing 12/28/2012 12:38:50 PM Report

highway 1

With all due respect, if you and I agree on 99% of the opinions I share on this forum that 1% would no way in hell make me "come into league with the "leftys" and forcefully oppose the Harper government."
Overall Harper and the Conservatives are keeping Canada in fine shape given the world economy that we are facing.
What the Harper Haters focus on amounts to picking fly shit out of pepper.
goldie 12/28/2012 12:39:53 PM Report

Jimssm do not worry Canadians have a good memory at the polls. Let us keep on reminding them with a slogan, Do not forget what has happened to my Canada
skipper dave 12/28/2012 12:56:07 PM Report

Normally I sit in the chair and let the chemicals do their work and surf the net on an ipad.
Not today - NUMBERED ACCOUNT has really got my attention. There are several bloggers on here who have spent some time in the middle oil rich middle east, you know where a kid gets a lamborghini for his sixteenth cause they are awash with greenbacks. Now after reading Numbered rant and rave how the reserves like attawapiskat are awash, nye choking on the green stuff I'm sorely tempted to open a cadillac escalade dealership right off the reserve. I also googled mapped the township trying to spot the rich section. His whole tirade stinks of tales past where hitler youth spread lies and untruths about the jews in order to justify the cleansing. Hey Numbered lets start somewhere, show me the financial report from Debeers of the currency they handed over to the reserve, not in trust and not to a third party. Lets start there. Wonder if I should throw in some lincoln navigators to make a better mix?
Zing 12/28/2012 1:19:57 PM Report

Finally some hockey to watch on the 'telly' Slovakia 3 , Canada 2.

Go Canada Go!
Zing 12/28/2012 1:33:01 PM Report

Canada now leads 4-3, FYI.
Jimssm 12/28/2012 2:58:44 PM Report

Those same persons labeling the protesters 'terrorists' would be all gung ho for them if it were a Liberal or NDP government in power.

That's all I need to know to dismiss their arguments.


These are simply protestors trying to get the government's and Canadian people's attention. If this forum is any indicator, they have succeeded.

No need to agree with them, just start looking at the Bill as presented.
mallet 12/28/2012 3:38:13 PM Report

Skipper Dave...

I never believe all that is written, but normally there is some truth there somewhere. I dont think that 7058262 mentioned anything about Caddy's or Lincolns, and he did not mention Chief Spence's salary either, and I seem to remember that some of the western Chiefs were taking home some fairly good salaries when compared to some of the others.. Now if that is cause for concern prehaps what a lot of people want from Harper's government is transparency maybe we should expect it from everyone, First Nations Chiefs as well.
Snobank 12/28/2012 3:39:24 PM Report

No one, to my knowledge, who posts on this site has yet to claim they read the omnibus bill. I'm not talking about reading the slanted 50plus Page summary. Two people, one being me, have admitted to starting it.

If you have read the entire bill please say so, so we can ask you questions. If you have not read the bill please do not instruct others to read the bill as a form of arguments rebuttal. This even applies to guys who continue to plagiarise Limbaugh by claiming to have tied a portion of their brain to their backsides. I dunno, maybe they think this makes them more attractive.Maybe it does.

I have not even come close to reading the entire bill so am not commenting on its comments. I shall now return to reading the hate and vitriol being heaped on a politician who is attempting to shame a king.

(It's a good thing she is not also a teacher. She'd never get out alive.)
mallet 12/28/2012 4:02:16 PM Report

Snobank...

Reading it, and then understanding it are two different things, you need to be a lawyer to understand it and even then you may want a second opinion. Those bills are not meant to be read and understood by the average person, the best you can hope for is that your MP is looking out for the best interests of the country, but sadly party politics and special interest groups holds sway over most.
Jimssm 12/28/2012 4:03:32 PM Report



Snobank...


I have not read Bill C45. It is way too complicated and I don't have enough brain cells left.



I will just take the opinion of Stephen Harper himself....

.... undemocratic



skipper dave 12/28/2012 4:03:43 PM Report

Mallet what we do have is abysmal poverty, what we do have is Numbered claiming harper is addressing the problem. What we do have is abysmal poverty. Which of those statements is not factual and which statement is irrefutable?
mallet 12/28/2012 5:26:20 PM Report

Skipper Dave...

I do not know how to answer you without sounding and being very crass.. Yes there is abysmal poverty on some reserves, poverty on others and some are in fairly good shape. So how do we or they bring themselves up to the ones in fairly good shape, do the ones in good shape recieve more financial aid than the ones in poverty?? I do not know, do you? As for education, does that not come under provincial government? not federal? Water and sewage, that comes under provincial rules, Walkerton comes to mind. As I understand a lot of services are joint federal/provincial but who is the paymaster I do not know. How do the bands work? I doubt if I would be that welcome at one of their financial meetings. I have to ask a question, would any of these isolated northern bands be willing to move to another area where there was infrastructure and work available?
skipper dave 12/28/2012 6:34:53 PM Report

This I know to be true - Our member of parliament is trying to defend Harpers record and she speaks of committees and studies and trust funds. I find that so demeaning and insulting - The town of Slave Lake is almost rebuilt with temporary housing filling in till the permanent was completed - Don't tell me we don't know the solution - bullshit - cancel the war planes and call the new model city F-35?
skipper dave 12/28/2012 6:57:12 PM Report

Oh I forgot - May 15 2011 Slave lake town burns to the ground - They are done!
flyhawk25 12/28/2012 7:39:12 PM Report

skipper dave...through pain comes clarity. Through age comes wisdom.
Thank you for sharing both.
northernmale 12/28/2012 8:32:05 PM Report

I for one made the statement yesterday, I did try to read the bill and was lost real fast. So I can only quess the people of the first nation have to take there chiefs at there word. As With me the jury is still out as I do not no enough about it. I think first nation people should appoint a committe that looks at all salerys of chiefs and council across Canada to see all monnies given to each band is used for what it is ment for. How do some bands do so much beter then others?? If fist nations want self goverment this would be a good spot to start from.
theprotector 12/28/2012 9:08:58 PM Report

right wing you are a sad excuse for a person. Harper is killing northern ontario. I have proof...they are taking over 75 % of government jobs and moving them to toronto. Yeah yeah yeah big deal, well you claim to be a business owner, how is a million dollars of earnings per year out of the community here in the Sault going to affect your business or other businesses? He has twice the staff in the PMO of any other prime minister, he does not care about the north nor does anyone else in any office seem to care. Blond hair female managers get promoted to senior positions and hauled off to Toronto making over 100,000 a year and they have never graduated even a college program!! But hey thats harper its ok cuz he is a conservative. Its not who you know it who you...
steelworker 12/28/2012 9:14:06 PM Report

Most of Slave Lake burnt to the ground and now it is almost rebuilt. I think Elvis called that TCB something some of these so-called Chiefs need to learn.
Just Curious 12/29/2012 12:15:11 AM Report

Really hate to disagree with you Skipper,but Slave lake is about insurance claims,not anything aboriginal or Harper or Dalton,strictly insurance and economics. Don't let the name of the problem throw you off. Some of your drugs on chemo may be adjusting your sights...In any event,hang in there,you are still an inspiration to me. If I get thru my demons and make it back to the Soo I want to meet you face to face...Just for a coffee,not a war...:)
skipper dave 12/29/2012 1:24:30 AM Report

Just Curious - The reason why was never the point of discussion. They got it done! Everything else is fluff.
steelworker 12/29/2012 2:36:09 AM Report

Road blockages mean nothing except to piss people off. Skipper: good luck and God speed I been where you are and was lucky to crawl out the other side.
Comments
39
Note: Comments that appear on the site are not the opinion of SooToday.com. If you see an abusive post, please click the link beside the post to report it.
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